3rd February 2000

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Topic: No More Mr. Nice Guy!!! (508 messages) Login to add messages

(Warning: Due to the nature of this week’s message board, visitors may find some of its contents offensive and unsuitable reading). George McAulay argues that the UK has been feminised not because the feminists have right on their side but because men have turned the other cheek and let them get away with it.

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Messages 1 to 25 (by thread) out of 508

Women will become unemployable   Dr. K. Seunarine - 10:17am Thu 03 Feb 00
Thanks to the feminists we have a situation where employers dare not fire their female employees. Women are given jobs not on their merits, but because they have beautiful curvy bodies and the politically correct believe they are the same as men.

Every week there is a woman claiming compensation for sexual discrimination/harassment for silly reasons such as her boss glanced at her knee. As women are given more and more rights (more than men) they will become more of a liability in the work place and a serious threat to the competitiveness of all companies. These companies will be forced to review their hiring procedures and will probably reject applications from women (maybe just paying them lip service). So women when you become unemployable you will have the radical lesbian feminists to thank.

Oh lookie whilst I've been typing this I've just received an e-mail from an insurance company. They say that they can't give me a quote as they only insure women drivers.

      Re: Women will become unemployable   sarah stokes - 02:57pm Thu 03 Feb 00
There is sexual discrimination already in the workplace - both positively and negativeley biased against women. Some employers discriminate against young women because it is viewed they will want to start a family and therefore will take maternaity leave, which many small business' can ill afford. On the other hand some women are baically employed to 'balance' statistics for equal opportunities. Neither of these situations enables a woman to feel they gained employment on their merit alone. Granted there are a lot of stories in the media regarding women making claims against sexual discrimination. But the law is there for a reason, and if it stops one person taking advantage of another (whether male or female), we can put up with some of these 'silly' claims.
      Re: Women will become unemployable   Darren Thompson - 04:34pm Thu 03 Feb 00
Dr Seunarine how can you be so naive ? Companies employ people who can make money for them. If they don't they lose out to the more efficient. Obviously being able to choose a woman or a man for a job , gives them a greater range to choice from (ie: x 2). Most people who get married or are in long-term relationships want to earn alot of money themselves , and would like patners who does the same. So everybodies happy , not much to do with feminism directly. As Marx pointed out ideas tend to gain popularity when the economic conditions demand them. Good chap Marx as long as you stick to his analysis. Final thought , why do people worry so much about who has the high paying jobs , rather than the fact that 90% of paid work in advanced economies has nothing to do with people's needs. How many farmers, health professionals , manufacturers of essential products ? How much does the economy value them ? Just a thought.
Gender solution fini ?   Darren Thompson - 10:49pm Mon 31 Jan 00
Personally I think all the women in the world should be killed , then all the men should be killed (by tranis). Think of all the problems that would solve. Green house warming ? Amercian sitcoms (apart from Frasier & Elan ) ? The irrating woman in the Renault advert (whoops) ? ;-)

Two wrongs don't make a right   John McGarvey2 - 11:21am Mon 31 Jan 00
Why is it that I should be blamed for something I didn't do. I didn't oppress women as I didn't enslave black people but I'm made to feel guilty for history. TV adverts are blatantly sexist, promoting aggression and discrimination and when you mention it you are greeted with, 'now you know what it feels like'. Two wrongs don't make a right. Being a male is fast becoming an oppressed group, perhaps I should complain to Brussels?
Discrimination   Dave Goodman - 12:52pm Thu 27 Jan 00
I won't deny the fact that women are perhaps still discriminated against. However, this is also the case for men, yet they are expected to just accept this. What we need to do is to readdress both issues, not just the feminist issue and try to live more happily together without all this bitchiness!!
TOP BLOKE   Dave Goodman - 12:43pm Thu 27 Jan 00
At last some guy's had the guts to address an issue which is ignored by women, as it is seen as being sexist if a man stands up for male rights, but not for a women to. George, you are a top geezer and have the full support of ALL of us blokes in Britain!!
      Re: MESS WIV ME I FINK NOT!   Jo Balls - 12:50pm Wed 26 Jan 00
look i've calmed daan some what... but i really would like to hear your version of reality, cause BABY mine is the truth and ya know it!
           Re: MESS WIV ME I FINK NOT!   Donald McCaskey - 12:07am Thu 27 Jan 00
Jo, If you're drug induced reality is the truth, I think I'd prefer to live a lie.

Come on, be honest, you must've been on something when you made your original post. Just what point were you trying to make?

Iron George   S.J. Anderton - 11:32am Wed 26 Jan 00
I thought Counter Blast was an excellent programme, relating issues that do concern many people. In a time when people are expected by society to conform to the opinions governed by political correctness and the media, I think it is essential that the public can express their opinions without being branded sexist, homo-phobic or racist. Though some people don't agree with George, his opinions should be respected. Like many others I think George is concerned with the way family values in Britain seem to be slowly dying out. The media too seems only concerned with womens rights while mens problems are overlooked. I thought the whole point of equal rights was for us to be equal, yet women seem to have the upper hand in the face of society and in the eyes of the law.
Fishy   emmeline spankhurst - 11:01am Wed 26 Jan 00
A lot of support has been expressed on this board for the UK Mens' Movement. However, I haven't read any that declare they are a member of the organisation. The UK MM will presumably all have been informed about George's big TV appearance; a few of them presumably have computers as the Movement has a website. This means some (many?) of the postings you are reading on this board by men expressing support for G as if they had never heard of him or his ideas before, know him and his Movement intimately; but aren't mentioning the fact so as to give the impression of a great tidal wave of support.

A little deceptive, non?

      Re: Fishy   Peter Fisher - 01:38pm Wed 26 Jan 00
You might be right, I don't know, but personally I had never heard of the UK MM. I didn't see the programme, but heard 3 blokes discussing it and work and it just struck a cord with me.

As for a great tidal wave of support, I don't know, but if happily married men like me are starting to take notice, then boy somethings up!

I have 2 sons, who are quite openly discriminated against at school, the other day for example all the boys were kept in but not the girls. I get the impression that men are getting angry.


           Re: Fishy   T Tang - 08:04am Thu 27 Jan 00
Dr. K. Seunarine,

There is medical evidence/proof for this. It is called "aspergus" (sp?) syndrome. I saw an excellent documentary about it, but missed the follow up details. Since I work in a hospital, I might pop over and ask a consultant about it . . .

Bitch - Busters??- are you serious?   siobhan mckenna - 01:58pm Tue 25 Jan 00
i had to keep changing the channel last night because the content of Mr. Idiots' argument was too unbearable to watch. Does the man not read history? He clearly has never met a real women. Feminist approaches can be quite millitant ( by the way not all feminist are [continued]
      Re: Bitch - Busters??- are you serious?   Donald McCaskey - 09:39pm Tue 25 Jan 00

Wake up and smell the coffee. We currently live in a situation where, if a man and a women of equal ability go for the same job, in all likely hood the woman will get it because the employer is afraid of being accused of sex discrimination, especially if the employer's "quota" of women workers is low. Positive discrimination, although illegal, is actively encouraged and promoted, and by the government no less. I would have more respect for women and women's issues if they were prepared to compete with men on an equal footing. But they're not. They want all these safeguards and quotas and if these aren't enough to guarantee them that job or this promotion then they cry "foul" and run to the equal ops commission.

           Re: Bitch - Busters??- are you serious?   siobhan mckenna - 03:52pm Wed 26 Jan 00
Donal- Postive discrimination, affirmative action, quotas have been introduced to "redress the imbalance of past history" if women and men were treated equally from the beginning we would not need these programs. As it stands, less women than men are found in middle and upper management when they are there they are paid on average 20-25% less than a man doing the same thing. this is not the case always, but more frequently than not. It is to do with visibility, the same applies to ethnic minorities and disabled.Why are men so afraid of women? Equality opportunity, equal pay and equal respect is what it is all about. So you wake up and smell the coffee!!!!!!
                Re: Bitch - Busters??- are you serious?   Donald McCaskey - 07:53pm Fri 28 Jan 00
Siobhan, Positive discrimination is illegal, that means it's against the law. Why should men stand back and allow their rights to be erroded to redress a history that they did not make. The employment practices of yesteryear were nothing to do with me, so why am I suffering for them? If women are truly equal, then they should be prepared to compete for jobs and promotions on that basis. Anything else makes a mockery of the whole thing. You ask why men are afraid of women. Perhaps the fact that women won't compete on this basis is the answer.
      Re: Bitch - Busters??- are you serious?   T Tang - 08:35am Thu 27 Jan 00
History is written by the victors. When Hitler came to power he had all the school history books burned and re-written. According to his new "revisied" edition, the Germans intervned to save the Allied forces in the first world war.

What about the Bible? How many versions are there? Which is the correct one? How do you translate eastern culture and beliefs into english?

I do not think that women should be treated as second class citizens, as outlined in you message. But I have always felt that MEN were treated as second class citizens, who have no say and no rights.

Do you agree that men should be given rights equal to those of women? Do you believe that flawed sexist legislation should be opposed and overturned? Do you believe in justice?

I suspect you do - your message sounded intelligent and rational - but you have only been aware of transgressions that affect your good self - ie transgressions agains women.

Feminists can indeed be terrorists   Melissa H - 01:25pm Tue 25 Jan 00
Mr McAulay had some valid, and touching things to say. Extreme feminists terrorise not only men into silence, but bully women into going along with their agenda - even if it means sacrificing their families for the 'good' of all (other) women. I don't deny the women's movement has helped [continued]
      Positive Discrimination - Where?   emmeline spankhurst - 10:47am Wed 26 Jan 00
"Positive employment discrimination..." Can someone tell me what these quotas are because I really wasn't aware we had them in this country. Which companies actually lay aside a certain percentage of their jobs exclusively earmarked for female applicants? I think this is certainly incorrect: female CEOs are still very much a minority. However I await correction: but facts please and figures not rants. What are the companies' names?

What I think you may be referring to are training programmes a few companies may run in order to try and encourage more women to APPLY for managerial positions: this however is far from handing them a job on a plate. Businesses will always have financial not social interests at heart in the end. I think you'll find +ve discrimination is something of a myth.

           Re: Positive Discrimination - Where?   Donald McCaskey - 11:59pm Wed 26 Jan 00
Ok Emmeline, why don't we start with the Government. Since you obviously don't understand what positive discrimination is, I'll go through this very slowly. Women-only candidate shortlists basically means only women can apply to become a candidate for election as a Labour MP. That means men can't apply to be [continued]
Re: To all the ladies here..   Patricia Dolan - 11:14am Tue 25 Jan 00
Ken, Jezzie's abusive reply to your posting should make you realise that George McAuley has a point. We have become a society in which respect has lost its mutuality (if there's such a word.) Some of the comments from women on this board, many of them extremely abusive, only underline George's point. George is a good man who has a right to be angry. He is addressing an issue of great injustice in our society, and he deserves the support of all who genuinely believe in equality.
      Re: To all the ladies here..   Graham Clark10 - 08:57pm Thu 27 Jan 00
Pat, are you related to George by any chance?
George, what are you on?   Graham Clark10 - 10:57pm Mon 24 Jan 00
George, do people like you really still exist? Bernard Mannings got nothing on you has he? Where was you're evidence? If your gonna spout rubbish about why its 'natural' for men to lead the family and the fact that women are allowed to ride roughshod over men in the workplace then at least have the sense to back it all up with some decent data not just a couple of sad blokes like youself speaking the same mis-informed bull"@*%. Before you ask, I'm a bloke like you but unlike you I don't blame women for my lot in life. Lets face it George, without the strength and commitment of women neither of us would be here. Heaven help your kids if the rubbish you came out with tonight is shaping their view of the world where all living in today. If nothing else your programme only served to convince me further of a guideline I try to live my life by - never trust a man with a 'tashe. 'Come and 'av a go if you think your hard enough' indeed. Idiot.
      Re: George, what are you on?   Patricia Dolan - 10:09pm Wed 26 Jan 00
Graham, You asked for evidence. Actually, it's there, if you have the courage to look. Try your local employmentn agency, for starters. They will be able to show you, amongst other things, that young boys leaving school are not getting jobs, but that girls are. This is absolutely tragic,and no one has the courge to do anything about it. By the way, George McAuley - about your ape man comment. I thought exactly the same thing when I read Graham's posting!
           Re: George, what are you on?   Graham Clark10 - 08:49pm Thu 27 Jan 00
I can asure both George and Pat that my views are in no way an attempt to 'pull', far from it, I just happen to believe that George's ideas and those of his fellow anti-feminists are simply an attempt to turn back the clock to a time when 'women knew their place' as then men like George knew where they stood unlike now where he is lost. However George, if 'ape man posturing' is your view of males who are sympathetic to the female cause then there really is no reasoning with you is there?
                Re: George, what are you on?   Donald McCaskey - 08:40pm Fri 28 Jan 00

If your views are not an attempt to "pull" then why didn't you express some counter arguments instead of just saying "your talking bull"? Come on, if you really are "sympathetic to the female cause" you must have hundreds of facts and figures at your disposal. Why not use some?

What, you don't have any? At all? You mean, you really are just here to impress the ladies? Bad form, Graham, really.

equalisist   donna stringer - 10:19pm Mon 24 Jan 00
tons of essential points and issues submerged in defensiveness and fear. a better future would see both sexes unite to outdate the unwanted extremes in both genders. we are responsible to ourselves and each other in aiming for a balanced and equal society which encourages the individual expression of self. love and let live.
      Re: equalisist   T Tang - 08:47am Thu 27 Jan 00
Yes! Yes! Yes! The voice of reason!

IMHO the reason why men and women are unable to reconcile their differences is exactly because we see men and women as different! Try substituting the word "people" instead of men or women. And dont use gender words such as "male" or "female"!

Patricia   Patricia Dolan - 09:44pm Mon 24 Jan 00
George, I can't tell you how pleased I am that you are campaigning on this issue. I am appalled at the abuse in the media towards men. A couple of years ago I remember a woman saying on TV, "The only thing men care about is what's between their legs." [continued]
      Re: Patricia   Tony Luxton - 09:54pm Mon 24 Jan 00
I'm not flaming you, this is a serious question. Er, are you a woman?
           Re: Patricia   Patricia Dolan - 10:01pm Mon 24 Jan 00
Yes, I am a woman. Have you ever heard of a man called Patricia?
                Re: Patricia   Tony Luxton - 12:25am Sat 29 Jan 00
No, but you never know nowadays!
It's not equal, so not just!   Jack Elphinstone - 09:41pm Mon 24 Jan 00
This strong view has been well documented, and George McAulay has don a sevis to justice! The woman have bean bigits, and deseve to be torte if thay are perperd to lerne only the females who have open minds. I have agead with meney things that this true man has said, but we all need to love each other more, that is the only way mankind will progres. we shoudn't forget the lesons that Gundi, jesus, JL and the dialama thort us. like thous famas words "all you need is love" and the rest will fall into place. but ther is injustice hear some geners think that ther own ar superar, but we all know this is not true. so what did pepole like Gundi did when ther was ingustice shall we do the same? yes, but only peasefuly.

I want to know how I can get some teaching materal from this movment to show some teenage childran. pleas let me know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you can ad to my coments send to :-

thankyou love Jack.

      Re: It's not equal, so not just!   emmeline spankhurst - 09:46pm Mon 24 Jan 00
Jack- are you serious? I have never seen such bad spelling in my whole life. And I teach children. What happened at school, Jack? Too busy considering your own oppression to pay attention to the lady at the front? Please don't give this man any teaching materials.Ever. No, I mean it. He'd send it back and ask what language it was in.
           Re: It's not equal, so not just!   Donald McCaskey - 08:51pm Fri 28 Jan 00
If you are a teacher emmeline, then this country is in serious trouble. When I was at school, teachers, both male and female, were at least sympathetic towards those pupils who were struggling to learn. You're attitute seems to be, "He's a man, give him up as a lost cause!".

Hopefully, once the Government gives local authorities more power over bad teachers, teachers like you can be shown the door and real teachers who actually care about education standards, regardless of the sex of the pupil, will be employed in their place.

Net Etiquette   Stephen Page - 09:36pm Mon 24 Jan 00
FYI: To everyone typing in caps. Please read the Usenet.faq's.

      Re: Net Etiquette   imag inary - 10:29pm Mon 24 Jan 00
           Re: Net Etiquette   T Tang - 08:54am Thu 27 Jan 00
There is a saying. "Anger is no argument". The moment you resort to personal insults or throwing rocks at each other, you lose the intellectual argument.

Long messages in caiptals are harder to read than lower case messages, so I just skip them. Shout as loud as you like.

Angry   Mike Doyle - 09:25pm Mon 24 Jan 00
George is angry and so am I. I'm angry that 10,000 men a year die of prostrate cancer and only £47000 is spent on research. Compare to research on womens diseases

I'm angry that a recent home office report concludes that domestic violence is equally split between men and women but there is no support for men.

I'm angry that males of all ages commit suicide at far greater rates than women but no-one seems to care.

There are 34 female labour M.P.'s illegally elected because of women only lists.

The list goes on.

I'm angry that feminism presents women as all good and men as all bad. Femninism is about womens rights not equality. Its the most ridiculous ism since communism.

      Re: Angry -- you're talking rubbish   Caroline Hadley - 09:37pm Mon 24 Jan 00
medical research funding is arbitrary and can never be attributed to male/female discrimination - that is absolutely absurd. MS kills more people than AIDS (as do many diseases and conditions) yet AIDS receives HUGE amounts of research funding. why? it's certainly nothing to do with the sex of the victims. don't reduce it to "women's diseases" and "men's diseases" - you're just adding to the kind of stupid discrimination we're trying to abolish here.
           Re: Angry -- you're talking rubbish   craig collins - 06:50am Tue 25 Jan 00
It has a lot to do with the sex of the victim.Why are male popstars like Elton John and George Michael doing Aids concerts all the time? To raise money to defeat a disease that mainly affects gay men.Would they do these concerts if Aids killed primarily women?
                Re: Angry -- you're talking rubbish   Caroline Hadley - 09:29pm Tue 25 Jan 00
craig - you've just proved the opposite - by pointing out that a disease that affects men is getting WAY more money than any disease affecting mainly women!! medical research funding is based on a myriad of reasons, some of which make sense, some of which are seemingly arbitrary and based on money/etc. besides - i hardly think that the male-dominated world of science would be funding breast cancer research over prostate cancer research just because of some pro-female discrimination.
                     Re: Angry -- you're talking rubbish   Donald McCaskey - 08:15pm Fri 28 Jan 00
By and large, medical research in this country is funded by the government. A government appointed commitee decides how that money is spent. That, in a nutshell, means that research is politically driven and whatever is "flavour of the month" gets the most funding. When Aids first came on the [continued]


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